Greenwald and the Guardian try again, only this time there’s warrants

Edward Snowden

Edward Snowden

Glenn Greenwald, the blogger-polemicist turned Guardian columnist, finally got his walk in the sun, when a disgruntled hacker type named Edward Snoweden pilfered top secret files from … one of his several (?) top secret clearance NSA contractor jobs and leaked them to Greenwald and the Washington Post. Greenwald’s victory lap across our television screens, from friendly interview to friendly interview (except the one where he lectured the CNN anchor for not being solicitous enough), has been impressive. He finally has given Obama disappointees, emoprogs and civil libertarians of the left and right something to wrap their “Obama is just like Bush” mantra around (expressed with more subtlety by Gary Younge here) while also giving us all an opportunity to laugh dryly at CNET. And he has triggered The National Conversation on national security and the war on terror that the president tried and failed to do in May, when his national security reset speech was greeted with snickers of skepticism and contempt from the ranks of emoprogdom, because drones.

Well the breathless coverage of Snowden has settled into variations on this face –> x_O, due to Snowden having shifted gears from warning that any given IT guy at an NSA contractor has the “authorities” to email-tap the president, expose all our CIA assets, and listen to your calls to grandma, to telling the Chinese and the Russians on us. So maybe “hero” not so much… And now he’s charged with theft of government property and two violations of espionage laws: unlawful distribution of classified material to an unauthorized source, and unlawful dissemination of classified information about communications intelligence (the charges not being quite the Government Sanctioned Hit he darkly warned of… but it’s setting up an extradition drama with Hong Kong anywyay.)

INTERESTING READ: NBC’s justice correspondent Pete Williams explains why Edward Snowden does not qualify as a whistleblower

Which brings us back to Mr. Greenwald, who from his undisclosed location, continues to act as Snowden’s chief promoter and hype man … I mean “journalist” … conducting live web chats!… and otherwise working hard to weave Snowden into a mythic hero of old. (I’m thinking a Gandalf beard might help. Greenwald should have Snowden get working on that…)

Bob Cesca summed up the problems with Glenn’s initial reporting, which continue to taint his present course of self/Snowden-promotion, in a piece from June 12 that’s well worth reading, including Greenwald’s error on whether the feds had “direct access” to Google, Facebook and other servers (they didn’t), why more technical details weren’t released by Greenwald and the Guardian, and whether Snowden’s leaked documents came from pre-Booz Allen jobs, or whether he took the Booz job with the intention of leaking. (Cesca asks another great question, namely: why Snowden chose to leak to an agenda reporter like Greenwald, who is a self-admitted “tech noob” rather than to an outlet like Wired, where the reporters presumably would have had a greater understanding of the technical aspects of what he was releasing… all good questions.

Well now, we’re finally getting some clarification from the Guardian, which seems to have given Greenwald a minder — reporter James Ball. Together, they’ve posted a rather clarifying new piece, in which they reveal that no, the govmint isn’t grabbing “everyone’s” phonecalls after all, and if they do sweep up Americans in their bulk data collection, they need a warrant to use it, or they have to destroy it. Ahem…

From The Guardian which I have to say does an impressive job of trying to retain the ominousness of their now diminished reportage:

The Guardian is publishing in full two documents submitted to the secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (known as the Fisa court), signed by Attorney General Eric Holder and stamped 29 July 2009. They detail the procedures the NSA is required to follow to target “non-US persons” under its foreign intelligence powers and what the agency does to minimize data collected on US citizens and residents in the course of that surveillance.

The documents show that even under authorities governing the collection of foreign intelligence from foreign targets, US communications can still be collected, retained and used.

The procedures cover only part of the NSA’s surveillance of domestic US communications. The bulk collection of domestic call records, as first revealed by the Guardian earlier this month, takes place under rolling court orders issued on the basis of a legal interpretation of a different authority, section 215 of the Patriot Act.

The Fisa court’s oversight role has been referenced many times by Barack Obama and senior intelligence officials as they have sought to reassure the public about surveillance, but the procedures approved by the court have never before been publicly disclosed.

Uh huh .. “can,” “but”… may or may not but hey you never know! … please proceed, Guardian …

The top secret documents published today detail the circumstances in which data collected on US persons under the foreign intelligence authority must be destroyed, extensive steps analysts must take to try to check targets are outside the US, and reveals how US call records are used to help remove US citizens and residents from data collection.

However, alongside those provisions, the Fisa court-approved policies allow the NSA to:

• Keep data that could potentially contain details of US persons for up to five years;

• Retain and make use of “inadvertently acquired” domestic communications if they contain usable intelligence, information on criminal activity, threat of harm to people or property, are encrypted, or are believed to contain any information relevant to cybersecurity;

• Preserve “foreign intelligence information” contained within attorney-client communications;

• Access the content of communications gathered from “U.S. based machine[s]” or phone numbers in order to establish if targets are located in the US, for the purposes of ceasing further surveillance.

Hm. And they’re doing all of that without warrants? Um, no. They’re not. More Greenwald:

Section 702 of the Fisa Amendments Act (FAA), which was renewed for five years last December, is the authority under which the NSA is allowed to collect large-scale data, including foreign communications and also communications between the US and other countries, provided the target is overseas.

FAA warrants are issued by the Fisa court for up to 12 months at a time, and authorise the collection of bulk information – some of which can include communications of US citizens, or people inside the US. To intentionally target either of those groups requires an individual warrant.

Wait. So the NSA DOES target people who are overseas? And sometimes in doing so, domestic calls get swept up in the bulk collection? But if that happens, the NSA would need to obtain an individual warrant to look into that U.S. person??? And … and … the collection of U.S. phone data IS incidental to the NSA’s only job: which is the collection of foreign communications intelligence? Well damn. And I was all ready to make a NObama sign…

Anyway, let’s keep going. Glenn: what are those circumstances in which the phone data of U.S. persons gets retained by the govmint?

NSA minimization procedures signed by Holder in 2009 set out that once a target is confirmed to be within the US, interception must stop immediately.


However, these circumstances do not apply to large-scale data where the NSA claims it is unable to filter US communications from non-US ones.

The NSA is empowered to retain data for up to five years and the policy states “communications which may be retained include electronic communications acquired because of limitations on the NSA’s ability to filter communications”.

Even if upon examination a communication is found to be domestic – entirely within the US – the NSA can appeal to its director to keep what it has found if it contains “significant foreign intelligence information”, “evidence of a crime”, “technical data base information” (such as encrypted communications), or “information pertaining to a threat of serious harm to life or property”.

Domestic communications containing none of the above must be destroyed. Communications in which one party was outside the US, but the other is a US-person, are permitted for retention under FAA rules.

The minimization procedure adds that these can be disseminated to other agencies or friendly governments if the US person is anonymised, or including the US person’s identity under certain criteria.

A separate section of the same document notes that as soon as any intercepted communications are determined to have been between someone under US criminal indictment and their attorney, surveillance must stop. However, the material collected can be retained, if it is useful, though in a segregated database:

“The relevant portion of the communication containing that conversation will be segregated and the National Security Division of the Department of Justice will be notified so that appropriate procedures may be established to protect such communications from review or use in any criminal prosecution, while preserving foreign intelligence information contained therein,” the document states.

OK, let’s break that down, shall we?

The NSA is only permitted to collect the communications data of non-U.S. persons.

If a U.S. person is believed to be on one end of the call, and that’s confirmed, the U.S. person’s phone data must be destroyed, unless the U.S. communication contains evidence of a crime, evidence of a threat, or encryption that indicates evidence of the foregoing.

And in that instance, the NSA would have to obtain an INDIVIDUAL WARRANT to look into that U.S. person’s communications.

If a U.S. person is at one end of a foreign call and it turns out that American is under criminal indictment and the call is with their attorney, the surveillance of that communication must stop immediately, and the information can be used to develop national security info, but cannot be used against the American in court.

In other words, the NSA is not listening to all of our phone calls (which we already knew because what Glenn initially uncovered were three-month warrants compelling phone companies to turn over bulk metadata under a court order, which they did through a Dropbox type third party server, NOT by giving the govmint “direct access” to their servers, as Greenwald erroneously reported and the Guardian only later corrected. What this all turns out to be are the worst case scenarios spun by a very disgruntled IT guy, who mainly proved that very disgruntled IT guys have access to your metadata, and to lots of national security information too, even if they’re not read into, and don’t really know all that much about, the programs being administered at the NSA.

It seems to me that the Guardian is trying to save face with these later stories, showing more documents but attaching them to much more carefully edited articles. The current piece has the fragrance of Legal Department on it — and clearly the Guardian decided to put in all the factual caveats that take the sizzle out of the narrative, while allowing Glenn to keep in his “coulds” and “mays” and “mights” — as to what the government might be able to possibly do with American phone data it inadvertently sweeps up in the bulk collection of foreign communications intelligence — the sweeping up and analysis of foreign communications being the sole purpose, you see, of the NSA…

Bob Cesca? Your witness:

An alternate headline for Greenwald’s new article could be, “Shit Happens But There Are Numerous Bureaucratic Procedures To Prevent Shit From Happening.” In other words, based on Document #1, a U.S. person’s data might be accidentally collected when it shouldn’t have been, but when it is, it’s killed. And we have no idea how often this happens.

Sure there are holes and glitches that absolutely need to be addressed, and there’s certainly the potential for abuse somewhere along the line. But the same could be said about any institution — governmental, corporate or otherwise. As we’ve seen with TSA, for example, sometimes people are patted-down who shouldn’t be, leading to unnecessary invasions of privacy. The system isn’t perfect, but until it’s repaired, there appear to be procedures for minimizing any potential hiccups.

So what began two weeks ago as a story about the NSA following your every keystroke as you type it has been shaved down to accidental data collection and no targeting of citizens without a warrant.


BTW, besides Cesca, the best person to read on this stuff is Kurt Eichenwald, who not only debunked much of the Greenwaldian panic with this and other great posts, he wrote about PRISM like, years ago. I just downloaded his book 500 Days, and can’t wait to read it. In fact, in many ways, the latest Greenwald/Guardian story is just a less compelling rewrite of Eichenwald’s June 14 piece, only without the Vanity Fair journo’s technical expertise. Go figure.

This entry was posted in News and Current Affairs and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

31 Responses to Greenwald and the Guardian try again, only this time there’s warrants

  1. Bettie V. Beard says:

    I actually feel sorry for Snowden! Sure he violated his contract with NSA contractors and not only hacked but leaked classified material to an unauthorized source, but he seems to have been a pawn in an evil attempt to scandalize the Obama Administration. Even Greenwald blindly became a pawn in this sordid affair. Their legal counsel should have enlistedthe help of someone willing to do the grunt work of closely studying the intricate technical details of FISA and the Patiot Act.

    Whoever was behind this mess could care less about the fix that Snowden and Greenwald are in and this is some deep treacherous and traitorous MESS.

    Both Snowden and Greenwald should be brought up on charges, but I have a gut feeling that something will prevent that from occuring.

    • kfreed says:

      “Libertarian Glenn Greenwald of Cato Institute” isn’t a pawn, he’s an accomplice known for creating anti-government hysteria with his more often than not false reporting (some might even call it propaganda). And Snowden is a criminal who now admits to having taken a job with a private contractor after obtaining a security clearance with the specific intention of stealing state secrets, then he handed them over to the Chinese.

      Yes, “Libertarian Glenn Greenwald of Cato” – Koch-funded that is – (our most infamous anti-government, specifically anti-Obama government, villianaires):

      And here’s the principled, anti-war, civil libertarian Cato, the orgnal the brains behind the Patriot Act:

      The Nation: “Independent and Principled? Behind the Cato Myth”

      “Another Cato Institute executive, Roger Pilon, vigorously supported Bush’s attacks on civil liberties. Pilon, Cato’s VP for legal affairs and founding director of the Cato Institute’s ‘Center for Constitutional Studies,’ supported expanded FBI wiretapping in 2002 and called on Congress to reauthorize the Patriot Act as late as 2008.”

      And here we have Greenwald shilling for the Tea Party (Joy Reid’s own post circa 2011):

      “Re-rise of the Naderites: Glenn Greenwald’s third party dreamin’ **UPDATE: on Libertarianism”

      “At a talk given the day after the 2010 election — one that was a disaster for Democrats — “progressive” writer and civil liberties lawyer Glenn Greenwald gave a talk at the University of Wisconsin, and expressed the hope that Democrats might suffer the same fate in 2012. ”

      Anyone who wants to continue idolizing Greenwald in spite of his fact-challenged “reporting” can certainly do so, just don’t try to play him off as the innocent dupe or as a progressive. He’s following the Koch strategy to the letter: how to drum up liberal resentment and dupe progressives into undermining their own party.

      P.S. #StandWithRand / [snark alert]

  2. Yawn says:

    Great, it’s all a big misunderstanding! So let silly-billy Snowden come back to the US and don’t charge him with anything, since he didn’t disclose anything important or anything.

    • Alli says:

      Uhm..he STILL broke the law. What happened here is that he didn’t expose any crimes as Greenwald wanted you to believe.

  3. Yawn says:

    I mean, really, if this simply a lot of nothing why is Snowden being charged with espionage? Because he defied authority and made the US gov’t look bad?

    • cosmic-surfer says:

      As far as Cesca being one of “the best to read on this subject”…So facts mean nothing but opinion means everything? I love Cesca on many topics but he is entirely opinion.
      If one is so shallow that he gains his “insight” from others instead of weighing the facts and weeding out the scams then he is no more aware than the fool pissing on himself and claiming it to be a hot summer rain.

      Cesca, in his latest piece, goes for the cheap shot of avoidance while exacerbating the biggest issue of all – the move to keep us all divided and fighting among ourselves so we ignore the real story.

      This author does a great job of keeping that fire kindled

    • Alli says:


      In what world do you steal gov’t info or property and get to walk? I love the way some of you just shrug off crimes against the gov’t.

      • Yawn says:

        So charge him with theft of gov’t property. Why espionage? Where’s the evidence he gave classified information to an enemy?

      • Lydia says:

        “But if that happens, the NSA would need to obtain an individual warrant to look into that U.S. person???”

        No. “The Fisa court-approved policies allow the NSA to…:” “Retain and make use of “inadvertently acquired” domestic communications if they contain usable intelligence, information on criminal activity, threat of harm to people or property, are encrypted, or are believed to contain any information relevant to cybersecurity.” WITHOUT an individual warrant. The NSA only has to “appeal to its director.” You are sloppy, Greenwald is not. Go back to sleep.

  4. Yawn says:

    Or they could just charge him with theft of gov’t property, which carries a 10yr sentence. Why espionage when there’s no evidence he gave sensitive information to an adversary?

  5. Kathy says:

    You have a few holes in your arguments. And you did not convince me.

    For example, that whole “targeting” bit. And how they determine someone is a US citizen. When the officials lie or as they say “tell the least untruthful thing” how can I trust that they’re not redefining “target” or not bothering to “notice” that someone is a citizen.

    • cosmic-surfer says:

      Holy yellow cake and aluminum tubes…Of course he doesn’t convince you – and he wrote every thought on a different post to fill space .

      Until we, as a people, stop allowing ourselves to be led down the primrose path created by a well oiled PR machine that excels at smoke screens creating diversion as they cover their covert acts (too include keeping the wound of 9/11 open and pouring blood, oozing with pus and anger), whistleblowers will be the pariah we create.

      Why did Snowden run? Does the torture of Bradley Manning actually have to be replayed in-depth nightly for it to have effect? Or the play on stage – the persecution on the House and Senate Floor daily for months after his arrest? How about the persecution of non-citizens who tried to let us know about the slaughter of innocents (to include journalists) at the hands of JSOC then covered up and denied. How about the continued persecution of even Don Siegelman?

      Our own belief in America’s Exceptional nature plays into our weakness to a good con.

      Anyone in the US government that commits a criminal or even questionable act, the first thing that happens is an elaborate cover-up – Nixon and Watergate as well as CREEP; Clinton and “I did not have sexual relations with that woman”, Bush and Yellow cake/WMDs and Saddam planned WTC destruction; Johnson and “Gulf of Tonkin”.

      Unless and until we stop following the rose petal trail of crumbs left by the NSA, FBI, CIA and the WH, we will never focus on what we need to have to stop our own self-destruction.
      As far as Snowden – listen to what other NSA whistleblowers have had to say…
      oh, never heard about this story or tape? Try the lack of attention by those who want to keep the screen intact (to include the MSM owned and operated by huge corporations who play the game so well)

      As far as the People of the USA – We need to comprehend that we create our own messes. Unless and until we stop setting fires across the planet, we will always be firefighting

    • Alli says:

      Your own argument against Joy Reid’s article is lame. How do you determine someone is a US citizen? Really?

  6. Janedrake says:

    I mean, really, if this simply a lot of nothing why is Snowden being charged with espionage? Because he defied authority and made the US gov’t look bad?

    Because he stole government documents and leaked details of specific security operations to the world at large. Why is that so hard for people to grasp?

    • Bettie V. Beard says:

      @Janedrake — Because some people either don’t grasp or don’t want to hear the facts, especially if it doesn’t fit their political perception or persuasion.

    • Yawn says:

      “leaked details of specific security operations to the world at large. ”

      But wait, I thought “everyone already knew” what Snowden revealed. Which is it?

      • Janedrake says:

        Why is it so difficult to understand that there is a difference between exposing the existence of a (legal) program, and leaking details of how that program actually operates.

        It’s the difference between standing on a corner handing out a bucket of KFC (everyone knows KFC does chicken), or standing on the corner handing out the secret recipe of KFC’s ’11 herbs and spices’ to all comers.

  7. SueCB says:

    Espionage is turning classified information over to a foreign government. That’s what Snowden has done and is planning to continue to do. He’s got four computers loaded with it, and he’s buying his entree to various countries with it.

  8. It’s probably not that encryption is evidence of a crime. Encrypted e-mail is in fact the only way to send a private e-mail, and is widely used. You should use it. Everyone reading this should use it.

    According to the above, encrypted communications are kept for a ‘technical database’. In other words, probably, they are kept for cryptography research. This isn’t as scary as it might sound, because when you send an encrypted communication you presume that people you don’t want to read the message have possession of it.

  9. Mike says:

    If this were a movie, Snowden would be looking at himself in a mirror about now with a look of horror on his face as he realizes he was played by an operative who is now touring him through every political enemy of the United States before landing in that bastion of democratic Freedom, Venezuela. Cue the maniacal laughing by a spy guy cashing a check as Snowden realizes he’s no hero, just a pawn in a game that has gone on for 80 years now. Muchas Gracias, sucka.

  10. bjw says:

    For those who are asking the question since Ms. Reid is saying this is much ado about nothing then why bring charges against Snowden?

    Well I invite you to go to work for any research laboratory in the country and quit taking with you research docs after signing letter of confidentiality. Well, those same principles applies to the Government.

    The main point of Ms. Reid article is Greenwald and the Guardian broke the story telling you that the Government was listening to your phone calls and reading your email in real-time; but as of today Greenwald and the Guardian are reporting their initial report was wrong.

  11. Tani says:

    Snowden and Greenwald both need to be prosecute… And the only one who going to get away is Greenwald (under the 1st amendment ) and every person who think this guy some kind of hero and want to acquaint him and Snowden to MLK and Rosa Park (that was a slapped in the face to every civil rights fighter, past and present)…

    Snowden stole classified govt. Intel ran to HK (China), Greenwald made deal with the Guardian (UK) for the exclusive.. Which he purposely hid the facts and accused everyone from the President, DOJ, NSA Dir. and anyone who dare question his story… Snowden who GAVE (not force) govt. classified Intel. to China and Russia, he even gave classified Intel from the UK….

    Yes, he’s a criminal in my book.. People who are defender of Snowden/Greenwald don’t even know the extinct of the damage they cause and probably never will.. Heroes don’t run, they face their oppressors and demand true injustices be corrected, and that what King, Mandela, Rosa, Gandhi, etc. live and died for. Not made deals with America adversaries (China & Russia)… Now Snowden is doing the same thing the Nazis did at the end of WWII, ran to S. Amer…

    This President, yes this President didn’t run, didn’t LIE, face Russia, China, England, Germany, France, and Italy leaders and their people, even face the American’s Liberty organizations to address their concerns and to approve upon the programs to make sure it don’t intrude on American civil liberties and that what a leader does…

    • anonymous says:

      you should feel right at home then living under the 21st century iron curtain. the president did lie. congress has lied AND been kept in the dark and to top it all off, obama isnt even the main player and this isnt even the main story. think about this…if the nsa is sooooo good, why did the ambassador christopher stevens have to die? wanna know why? because another grown man has his hand up obamas hind quarters makin his mouth talk to protect their interests. the nsa and general alexander have blackmailed the whole damn world to further who’s interests? the most powerful money men in the world. thats how it works. youre a puppet too and once you disconnect your brain from the matrix, youll see that you gave up your civil liberties in the name of safety and heres the best part….terrorism on our soil will happen again. youre no safer than you were post 9/11. to think you are is lunacy. all snowden did was piss in their bowl of corn flakes…if hes not a spy and part of the ruse to take the focus off benghazi. i hope to god the next terror attack doesnt happen but if it does, i hope that you remember my words because there are no more warnings. wake up and smell your loss of freedom.

  12. bmull says:

    Are you comfortable with government computers knowing everything about you? That is the fundamental question here–not that you dislike Snowden or Greenwald, or think we should trust this President in everything he does.

    The Patriot Act and the FISA laws are not specific enough to preclude the government from collecting and analyzing all our data in almost any way it wants. We’ve seen parts of the rules and regulations but they’re full of loopholes, and in any case the rules can be changed at any time without further input from Congress.

    The biggest danger here is apathy: the public doesn’t understand the implications of the government having control of all their data. They assume our government is generally benevolent and that they personally have nothing to hide. But consider the case of abortion, in which the pro-choice position has been a diminishing minority for over a decade: Abortion rights are grounded in the same privacy and fourth amendment provisions as the current debate on domestic surveillance. Without those provisions Congress or some future president are eventually going to say to women, “Sorry but this is a democracy and we’ve decided you can’t have an abortion.” At that point there’s going to be a lot people who wished they’d been more adamant about civil liberties before it hit home for them personally. And so I urge you to put aside your petty grievances and take this a lot more seriously.

  13. Keeana Debair says:

    I don’t care enough about this stuff or the greenwald to read a piece that long. Joy I love love love you and your work but you need to work on concision where it doesn’t matter and expand where it do!

  14. EdieVP (@EdieVP) says:

    In my opinion, Glen Greenwald got his 15 minute fame and no the government is not listening to my calls as I bitch about them or anyone else. There is not enough manpower, time or funds to listen to millions of phone calls. When Greenwald is questioned by the media he becomes defensive and rambles on with innuendos and personal catty responses that lacks integrity and ethical professional behavior.

    Greenwald is an admitted White Nationalist who believes America should protect its white population from become over populated with brown and black immigrants. He thinks only white European immigrants should be allowed within its borders. Yes I have his statement on twitter. Greenwald supported Bush and did not complained or attacked him as he attack President Obama, hmmm I wonder why? Yes you as well as all of us know why, whether we want to admit it or not.

    Greenwald has lost all credibility in his recent tantrums of “patriotism”- a word I now have come to fear as people used it to shield their hate and misdeeds.

    The person who will suffer is Snowden who Greenwald manipulated and victimized but as an adult he is responsible for making an uninformed decision. I believe Greenwald used Snowden. If Greenwald wanted to expose the NSA’s “corrupted” practices, he should have lawyered up Snowden to protect him within the confines of the Whistleblower Act. Instead Greenwald misused Snowden for his own self-gain of fame and fortune and as an opportunist he destroyed Snowden’s life. In my opinion Greenwald has reduced his reputation to the level of a tabloid news reporter. Why because the facts are clear the NSA is operating within the law. Greenwald implied an intent of wrong doing and that is false so what is the difference between Greenwald and Fox News, not much. As long as any US citizens are not plotting to blow up buildings to kill as many as possible then there is nothing to worry about. What we should fear are the shadowy elites of billionaires as puppet masters and corporations who are selling out America.

    If the world must know how America protects it’s citizens, then there is no protection. No individual reveal to others how they protect their money, social security numbers and any other private information to avoid identity theft. To tell the world how America protects it’s citizens eventually those who may want to attack will succeed and it will be, Checkmate!

  15. Joan says:

    Why do I get the feeling that Snowden has been used by someone, perhaps Greenwald, who has an agenda. The fact is Snowden took an oath to uphold the interests of the US government and people when he got the job. He is now running around to all the countries that are enemies of the US, along with his laptop files and letting them all have copies of what the us using for security. Make no mistake, he is a godsend to our enemies, files that perhaps were destined to be destroyed by the US are now forever a permanent part of foreign files!
    If it does not make americans worried that our security secrets are open to the countries that Snowden calls ‘freedom of speech’ countries, we are not paying attention.
    If any of their people did what Snowden did they would have the death squads after him.

  16. Pingback: US – Joy-Ann Reid Is A Joy To Read – 24 June 2013 | World Leader Pretend

  17. Ronbo says:

    Yes, we must punish those who don’t comply with spying, deceit and misinformation. Wallstreet and banksters are free to pilfer our private information for their profit and control; but, revealing their theft is illegal.

    How many politicians have been muted and turned with information gathered by domestic spying? Journalists?

    Rosa Parks was a criminal. So were our nations forefathers.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>